#6 BONUS: The Watchers and the Holy Ones
Show Notes
Syndicated interview with Chuck from Fire Theft Radio.
How do we bring up the subject of fallen watchers and giants at church?
Why is it even relevant to know about?
Is this at all a subject worth discussing in bible study?
Chuck has an amazing conversation with Pastor, Podcaster, and author Anthony Delgado on why this subject is filled with practical meaning and understanding of biblical history. I’ve always said, “The more you know your bible, the more you’ll know what you're doing here.” We discuss Anthony’s book (The Watchers And The Holy Ones) and how we can use this so-called weird knowledge in church, counseling, and even evangelism. Never be afraid to research biblical knowledge that might not fit your current paradigm. But if you do, ensure it’s grounded in biblical context. Anthony’s book creates that bridge for the evangelical community.
Music: Trap Future Bass by Royalty Free Music
Podcast Transcript
Anthony Delgado: This light momentary affliction is preparing an eternal weight of glory for us, beyond all comparison, as we look not to the things that are seen but to the unseen (2 Corinthians 4:17-18). In a post-materialistic world filled with immense spiritual noise, we're here to uncover the ancient Near Eastern context of the Bible to recover the truly mystical faith of our spiritual forefathers. Welcome to the Biblical Reenchantment Podcast, where we bridge the gap between the ancient Hebrew story and modern insights.
I'm Anthony Delgado, your host for this journey into the often-overlooked mystical dimensions of the Bible. This is Episode Six, titled The Watchers and the Holy Ones. My listeners may recognize that as the same title as my book, The Watchers and the Holy Ones: An Evangelical Reading of 1 Enoch, the Book of the Watchers.
This episode is actually an interview syndicated from Fire Theft Radio. My good friend Chuck from Fire Theft Radio had me on his show to discuss not only my book but also some of the pastoral implications of the presence of the Watchers—some tidbits about giants, demons, some good alien stuff, Bigfoot, things like that. But really, looking at how this speaks into practical day-to-day ministry within the church setting. Chuck had me on his podcast to talk about this, and I thought, You know what? That’s going to be really good for you guys to hear.
So I’m going to play that for you today. Without further ado, let’s jump into Fire Theft Radio’s interview with me about The Watchers and the Holy Ones.
Chuck, Fire Theft Radio: All right, folks. Welcome back to another episode of Fire Theft Radio. Anthony Delgado, can you hear me?
Anthony Delgado: Yeah, I got you, man.
Chuck, Fire Theft Radio: All right, cool, man. Welcome back to the show. It’s been a while.
Anthony Delgado: Yeah, it has been a while. Hoping to catch up on more of your episodes. I drop in every now and then and listen to some—always good stuff and always good to hear your voice.
Chuck, Fire Theft Radio: Thank you. Thank you. Like I said, you’ve been busy, man. I saw you wrote the book—I had to read it, man. And you were kind enough to send me a copy, The Watchers and the Holy Ones: An Evangelical Reading of 1 Enoch, the Book of the Watchers. I got pretty excited. I was like, Oh, this is good stuff. For those who don’t know, tell them who you are and what you do so they can get a little taste of who you are.
Anthony Delgado: Right on, yeah, for sure. So, I’m a pastor at Palmdale Church in Southern California, in northern L.A. County. Palmdale Church is a church plant, about three years old, and we’re going for it—spreading the gospel, worshiping the Lord Jesus, and doing what churches need to do according to Scripture.
I also work as a substitute teacher at a local high school. I’m married with three kids—my oldest started college this year, and I’m proud of her and my other kids too. My wife and I, along with our family, are really interested in understanding Scripture from an ancient Near Eastern perspective. For quite a few years now, we’ve been studying the biblical context, which has led to some writing projects—The Watchers and the Holy Ones being my most recent one.
I also recently started a podcast called Biblical Reenchantment. If you want to sit and listen to me ramble for a while, go subscribe—it’s good stuff. We explore how the stories of Scripture, when understood in their ancient Near Eastern context, shape worldview. We talk a lot about storytelling, being honest about the things happening in the spiritual realm, and more.
Right now, I’m working on two more books—so be on the lookout for those.
Chuck, Fire Theft Radio: Yeah, yeah. If I’m not mistaken, you also put together a conference with Dr. Michael Heiser here in California. Some of our listeners are familiar with Heiser’s work. I actually had him on Fire Theft Radio years ago, before he released The Unseen Realm. But later, he came back to Southern California, and I was surprised that he was presenting his material at a church with church people—that was something you organized, right?
Anthony Delgado: Yeah, we did. We had Mike out, and he was gracious enough to join us. We called it the Miqlat Conference—Miqlat being his nonprofit, which his wife Dinna now runs. He gave a broad overview of The Unseen Realm for our congregation—not just our church, we invited a lot of different churches. We had a couple hundred people come out for it.
It was interesting—there were some conversations that took place offstage that helped frame some of the ideas Miqlat later expanded on, and that Drenna is carrying forward today. A lot of those early ideas were just forming then.
I first came across Dr. Heiser’s work a long time ago, back when he first started at Logos, before Naked Bible Podcast and all that. I found some of his articles on his old Dr. MSH site, saw some short videos he had done with Logos, and honestly, my first reaction was, Man, this guy is off the rails. I wasn’t into it at all. It took about two years before I came back around to his work and really started digging in.
My wife came across some of Dr. Heiser’s hermeneutics videos, and that's a soapbox of mine. I'm all about right and wrong ways to interpret Scripture. It’s funny—I talk about this in the intro of my book too. But yeah, when she told me, No, you’ve got to watch some of this guy's stuff, I finally delved in.
By the time I did, he had maybe five episodes of The Naked Bible Podcast out. I was able to binge those first few, watch all of his Start Here videos and hermeneutics content, and then follow the podcast all the way to the end. I’m definitely thankful to Dr. Heiser for his work on that, and I’m seeing so much more come out of his research—others are building on what he started.
Chuck, Fire Theft Radio: And it’s funny because you see some of these things, and either you’re ready for it or you’re not. One reason for that is that Heiser was an actual scholar touching on topics like UFOs and aliens, and you’re like, Wait, what? I get the hesitation.
I know there's an issue every time I bring up his work. I've tried at church, and it's been a bit of a challenge. Just a fair warning, guys—I do have a newborn, so you might hear some noise in the background. It’s not a big deal. My recording studio is in the baby’s room, so it is what it is.
Anyway, I want to get into two things. First, in the Red Pill and fringe communities, we’ve been talking about the Watchers for a long time. Now, with all this interest, you often see people who don’t even believe in the Bible quoting 1 Enoch and talking about the Watchers.
The problem is that many podcasts misquote this stuff because they just want to believe the strangest, weirdest aspects of it. So I want to clarify how this is actually useful within the church and how we should talk about it in a way that keeps it connected to the Bible—especially for people who only want to believe it because it sounds cool.
Right at the top of your book, it says Biblical Re-Enchantment. Can you explain what that means? Because I can already hear some people in the evangelical world saying, What do you mean? What are you re-enchanting about the Bible?
Anthony Delgado: Yeah, and this is controversial. Not everyone wants to hear what I’m about to say, but that’s okay. I feel like this is a safe place for it. I’ve talked about this extensively on my podcast.
All I mean by re-enchantment is exactly what the word suggests—bringing the enchantment back in. But don’t confuse enchantment with spirituality—that’s where people get tripped up.
To say something is spiritual is to speak of the metaphysical world, meaning the world that exists alongside the physical. All Christians believe in spiritual realities. Enchantment, however, has to do with how God designed the spiritual world to interface with and flourish in the physical world.
A good illustration is folklore about fairies. In those stories, fairies are responsible for making flowers bloom and causing things to grow. That’s the idea of enchantment—there’s an unseen force bringing beauty and life into the world.
Now, you also see enchantment in stories about wizards casting spells. You could call it enchantment when it's a good wizard or a good witch doing something beautiful, just as you could call it enchantment when it's a bad wizard or witch doing something destructive.
We actually see both of these in Scripture. The holy ones of heaven—remember, my book is called The Watchers and the Holy Ones—are the Watchers who didn’t leave heaven. Then you have the ones who did rebel. I assume your audience knows a little about the Watchers and the sons of God language in Scripture. So you’ve got the two-thirds who remained faithful, and the third that fell with the devil. That’s why you get both good magic and bad magic, good enchantment and bad enchantment.
It all comes down to how it manifests in the world.
I think the evangelical church—unintentionally—has removed enchantment from the faith. Nobody set out saying, I’m going to disenchant Christianity. What actually happened is that the Reformation was built on textual criticism. It emphasized a grammatical-historical reading of the text—figuring out what the original meaning was and returning to orthodox doctrine based on the text.
And that’s not a bad thing. But as history progressed and we lost touch with the ancient Near Eastern world, we started missing some key elements. Since the discovery of the Dead Sea Scrolls, we’ve learned so much about the ancient Near East—archaeologists are constantly finding things that bring this world to life.
But back when all that knowledge was lost, the process of continual reformation led Protestant Christians to deconstruct many of the enchanted elements of the faith. We kept the core—things like the Apostles’ Creed, the virgin birth, the incarnation, the Trinity. We never lost those.
But the more esoteric, beautifying elements of the biblical narrative—because we couldn’t connect with them—got explained away in more humanistic or materialistic terms. Things God put in Scripture to be light to us, to be beautiful, ended up being treated as strange or unnecessary.
So when I talk about re-enchantment, I mean recovering the faith of the first-century church—when people still had an enchanted view of reality. They understood the spiritual world as deeply connected to their lives. And that’s what I want to bring back.
Chuck, Fire Theft Radio: Yeah, because these days, especially with the rise of the New Age movement and all sorts of different religious beliefs, the context in which I sometimes see the term re-enchantment pop up is shifting. So when people see Biblical Re-Enchantment, they might wonder, What are you changing? There shouldn't be any changes. That could be a stumbling block for some, but that’s not what you're saying. You're bringing forth knowledge that we’ve kind of lost—or, I don’t know, maybe de-spiritualized.
I actually did an episode in our Hail Hydra series where we called it the De-Spiritualization of Christian Civilization.
Anthony Delgado: Yeah, that’s probably the same idea I’m talking about.
Chuck, Fire Theft Radio: We have very specific spiritual beliefs, but we don’t always extrapolate them further—especially when looking at history. We tend to forget just how mythological Christianity actually is. And I don’t mean mythological in the sense of being fake, the way people use the word today. I mean it in the sense of wonder—in the whoa, this is crazy kind of way.
A lot of intense spiritual things were happening—and still are happening, in my opinion. But we’ve lost awareness of it. We’re in the middle of this weird, intense battle, and I think your work is helping set the stage for people to see that.
Anthony Delgado: I hope so. You're absolutely right. One of the biggest problems today is that there’s an obvious spiritual movement happening in the world right now, and because we've lost so much of our biblical understanding of the spiritual world, people are turning to ancient paganism.
If we're honest about what’s happening, people are reviving ancient pagan concepts to explore spirituality. And the reason they’re doing it is that the church lost this knowledge. That’s why, pastorally, the number one reason to bring this back is to show people that we already have the answers.
Chuck, Fire Theft Radio: Yeah.
Anthony Delgado: If you look at ancient paganism and modern neo-spirituality, it’s always built on innovation. It’s about constantly inventing new ways to experience spirituality. It’s experimental, open-ended.
One of the misconceptions we have about magic comes from movies—like in Harry Potter, where if you say a spell wrong, it doesn’t work. But that’s not actually how magic worked in the ancient world.
Ancient magic was all about experimentation and innovation—finding new ways to engage with the spiritual world, ways to imprison spirits and force them to do your bidding. That’s what ancient magic was really about.
So when we look at the rise of neo-spiritualism today, we can’t just say, Oh, well, they’re good people, and they’re just exploring spirituality in their own way. No—what they’re actually doing is binding demons and trying to force them to act on their behalf.
When we recognize that, it gives us a context for understanding what’s really happening in the world.
Chuck, Fire Theft Radio: And I don’t know—this is just my opinion, and people might not agree, but I feel like modern psychology is basically a version of ancient magic.
Anthony Delgado: I’ll let you explain, but I’m already with you.
Chuck, Fire Theft Radio: Yeah, you agreed with me so quickly there—I appreciate that. But let me explain.
When I started looking into who our modern psychology is based on—Nietzsche, Jung, Freud, all these thinkers—I noticed something: many of them had ties to the occult. Their mothers were occultists, or they were directly involved in conjuring and esoteric practices.
Their ideas weren’t just coming out of thin air; they were drawing from ancient pagan traditions—ideas that have been re-enchanted into what we now call science.
We’ve been led to believe that psychology is separate from the spiritual world, but if you look at history, many things that we consider normal science—especially in fields like psychology—are actually rooted in occult practices.
Sometimes it's overt, sometimes it's subtle, but I believe modern psychology has been used as a diluted form of magic to manipulate people.
Anthony Delgado: Yeah.
Chuck, Fire Theft Radio: And it doesn’t even have to be nefarious. It could be something as simple as how companies use psychology in advertising—like propaganda to make you buy food.
Think about it. They use psychological tactics to influence your decisions. It works. I mean, I’ve got a Mac Mini and a bunch of stuff I probably shouldn’t have spent extra money on, but I was convinced that this was the best option.
Anthony Delgado: Yeah, I think you’re right about that. I wouldn’t even say it’s diluted—I think it’s just been masked over time.
Jonathan Pageau talks about this—he uses the Greek word egregore to describe the Watchers. He leans into a more idealized concept of them, but not because he denies the existence of real angelic beings.
Pageau comes from an Eastern Orthodox background, and he’s really smart—way smarter than I am. I have to listen carefully to everything he says.
But from what I understand, his take is that in the Old Testament narratives, the Watchers were physically manifesting and interacting with people because that’s what those people expected.
Those people had an understanding of the spiritual world, so they expected it. Daniel, for example, expects an angel to show up in his vision because he knows he’s a prophet who receives visions—that’s part of his world. So, he expects to see the Watchers, even though he’s still terrified when he does.
Jonathan Pageau talks about this idea in relation to modern times. If people today don’t expect to see angels or demons but are more interested in things like pharmaceuticals or artificial intelligence—then why wouldn’t the Watchers adapt? Why wouldn’t they say, I don’t need to go by Azazel or Shemihazah anymore—how about I go by Siri?
They don’t need to keep the same names. We know the names of spirits have changed throughout ancient history. I don’t think they care about their names—I think they care about their influence. They’re happy to take on whatever name will allow them to shift society in the direction they want, which is usually something that looks beneficial on the surface—something like, Hey, we’re here to help humanity! We’re bringing you secret knowledge that God was hiding from you!
That’s straight out of 1 Enoch, by the way. It’s always framed as though they’re building society, but what they’re really doing is pushing humanity just over the line, to the point where people no longer feel the need to worship Yahweh.
Chuck, Fire Theft Radio: And it would make sense that their names would change because their names were probably assigned by God. If you know biblical history, you know that names carry purpose and meaning. I imagine these beings wouldn’t want to be identified by the names God gave them, so they’d change them throughout history.
Do you think this is where all the other gods came from—this rebellion?
Anthony Delgado: If Pageau is right that these angelic beings still exist behind all of these societal ideas, then yes. But I don’t think the ones from Genesis 6 are the source of all the gods.
The Genesis 6 Watchers—the ones who took human wives—are chained in gloomy darkness, according to Scripture. So it wouldn’t be them. But the ones that came after them? Absolutely.
In Genesis 6, Moses says that the Nephilim were on the earth in those days and also afterward. So there were later groups of divine beings influencing the world. That’s where we get what Dr. Michael Heiser calls the Deuteronomy 32 worldview—the idea that God assigned the nations to different sons of God, who were supposed to rule righteously but ended up falling.
That’s the divine council rebellion described in Psalm 82. Those beings weren’t initially opposed to God, but they later came under judgment. They’re the ones we see in Job, where it says that the sons of God came before the divine council, and then it casually mentions, Oh, and Satan was with them too.
Then, by the time we reach the New Testament, we get a shift in terminology: the devil and his angels. That suggests that somewhere along the way, Satan went from just being one of the rebellious spiritual beings to leading the rebellion.
I know some people argue that the Satan in Job isn’t the same being as the devil in the New Testament, but I think the biblical narrative presents them as the same person. Even if the grammar could be debated, the storyline seems to treat them as one figure.
By the time we get to the New Testament, Satan is no longer just one among the rebellious sons of God—he’s in charge of them.
Chuck, Fire Theft Radio: Yeah, I get that. When I pray or talk about Satan, I sometimes struggle with how to refer to him because I know it’s a layered concept. I know that the Satan in Job isn’t necessarily the same figure people think of today.
But at the end of the day, Satan means adversary. Whatever their rank, these beings are against us. They are working against God’s will, and that’s the practical point.
I like how you structured your book. You present a scene about the Watchers, explain its biblical connections, and then reference 1 Enoch to show how it expands on those ideas.
For example, you quote 1 Enoch saying: There wasn’t much godliness on earth. Humankind committed sexual immorality of every kind, being led astray and corrupted in all their ways.
Then it lists what the Watchers taught humanity:
Shemihazah taught enchantments and root-cutting. And I always wondered—how does my mom know which plant will cure what? My mom has a remedy for everything. There are millions of plants in the world—how did she figure out which ones work?
I believe that’s ancient knowledge passed down from the Watchers.
Anthony Delgado: I think you’re right.
Chuck, Fire Theft Radio: Then there’s this next part that caught my attention—Hermione taught the loosing of enchantments. And I thought, That name sounds a little too close to Hermione Granger, but whatever.
Anthony Delgado: (Laughs)
Chuck, Fire Theft Radio: Then it says, Baraqijal taught the reading of lightning flashes.
Cocobel taught astrology. And I think that’s where things went sideways—because astrology, in its original form, was probably something entirely different, and the Watchers took it and corrupted it.
Ziqiel taught the knowledge of the clouds.
Artaqoph taught the signs of the earth.
It’s fascinating how these teachings match up with various ancient practices, and we can still see their influence today.
I can't pronounce that one—Atico... yeah, that’ll work—taught the signs of the earth. Samzîel taught the signs of the sun, and Sariêl the course of the moon. The giants revealed mysteries to their wives and children. As men perished, their cries went up to heaven.
I appreciate how you structure your book—you present 1 Enoch, then immediately provide an evangelical reading, giving the practical application and understanding. That really helps make sense of it.
Now, let’s talk about some of the weird stuff. We’re admitting that these Watchers—these heavenly beings—said, You know what? These human women look good; we’re going to take some for ourselves. That’s straight out of Genesis 6.
Why did you let go of the Sethite view? What convinced you that the sons of God in Genesis 6 aren’t the descendants of Seth? What was the nail in the coffin for you?
Anthony Delgado: Interestingly, I didn’t grow up with the Sethite view. I’d never even heard it. I can only remember one time, as a kid, when a pastor even taught on Genesis 6.
As a young adult, I was going to a church in Littlerock, and the pastor went through Genesis 6. He taught that the sons of God were angelic beings and that the giants were their offspring. That’s the historic view.
I come from a Baptist tradition, and Baptists can actually be very open to spiritual realities—unless they’re part of the neo-reformed, fundamentalist Calvinist strain of Baptists. That group tends to default to the Sethite view.
For me, the nail in the coffin was simple—I’m a student of hermeneutics, and I cannot find a way to get the Sethite view out of the text naturally.
The passage says nothing about Seth or Cain. It doesn’t mention humans at all in connection with the phrase sons of God. And nowhere else in the Old Testament is sons of God used to describe human beings—it always refers to divine beings.
Are we really supposed to believe that in Job 1, when Satan enters the divine council, he’s hanging out with a bunch of Sethites in the throne room of God? That’s not even happening on earth! It just doesn’t make sense.
You have to assume the Sethite view onto the text—it’s not in the text. And I’m highly critical of any theological position that requires people to assume something rather than derive it from Scripture.
Chuck, Fire Theft Radio: Yeah, that’s where the hermeneutics really come into play.
Anthony Delgado: Absolutely.
Chuck, Fire Theft Radio: I’ve always been in the Calvary Chapel world ever since I left my Pentecostal/Charismatic cult back in the day. It’s been a safer space for me in a lot of ways.
But every Calvary Chapel is different. Some will openly say, Yep, the Nephilim were real, those were demons, and they’ll return. And you’re like, Whoa, that’s wild—I didn’t expect a Calvary Chapel to go there.
Then there are others that completely reject that idea.
At one of the smaller Calvary Chapels I attended, I brought up Heiser’s work, and the youth pastor immediately called it heresy. He was like, Dude, Heiser is just trying to sell books. That’s heresy.
I gave him ancient context, biblical references, and everything I could to show him it was a valid interpretation, but he wouldn’t even read it. He straight-up refused.
At that point, I thought, Well, my days are numbered at this church.
And then—somehow—they made me the lead youth leader! I was like, What is going on?
So I tried to bring these ideas up in a way the youth could understand. And honestly, they were pretty receptive. It helped them make sense of mythology, of things they’d always had questions about—aliens, supernatural beings, all that stuff.
That leads me to another question—have you connected this to ancient mythological gods and aliens? And if so, have you brought that up in church?
Anthony Delgado: Yeah, completely.
First off, I’m a preacher. I used to be strictly an expository preacher—I’d go through books of the Bible, not always line by line, but section by section, dealing with the text as it came. That approach forces you to wrestle with topics when they naturally arise in the text.
These days, I preach more thematically.
Earlier this year, I did a seven-week series on Genesis, following the stories of the patriarchs. And of course, when I got to Noah, this topic was right there in the text.
Honestly, I think this material showed up in every single one of those sermons because Genesis is absolutely saturated with these ideas.
How could I not address it? How could I preach on Joseph and his diviner’s cup without talking about the supernatural context? It would be intellectually dishonest to ignore it.
So yes, it comes up in my preaching.
It also comes up in the small group I lead at church. That’s more of a venue for esoteric discussions, and the people who attend want to geek out on the weird stuff.
But that also presents a challenge—because they’re already into this material. They expect it, they want it. So instead of just revealing the spiritual world to them, I have to focus on framing it biblically—keeping it tied to Scripture rather than letting it drift into speculation.
Now, I'm trying to steer this teaching back toward what's practical and applicable—where people see this in their own lives. So, definitely, in teaching, it’s showing up.
One of the interesting places it shows up is in counseling, and the other is in evangelism. In biblical counseling, people have often already explored secular solutions. They've gone to psychologists, set up behavioral therapy, and maybe even started medication. Yet, despite all that, it’s not really working.
They might be on medication that's tempering the issues but not actually resolving them. So, it allows a context where I can say, Look, there’s probably a deeper issue here.
Now, I'm a both-and guy. If someone thinks they’re being spiritually attacked and they’re on medication that seems to make those visions or experiences disappear, I’d say, Yes, take the medication. Because if it’s making the demon go away, then it’s serving a purpose.
I believe spiritual things are saturated in every aspect of life—there's always a physical and a spiritual side to everything. That’s literally what the terms physical and metaphysical mean. The physical universe is the material plane, and the metaphysical exists alongside it.
So, every pill someone takes—whether it's for ADHD, bipolar disorder, or whatever—addresses the physical side of a spiritual issue. I see it as a both-and scenario.
Chuck, Fire Theft Radio: Well, I never said it was all bad, you know what I mean?
Anthony Delgado: Yeah, you’re right. I shouldn’t put words in your mouth. But let me illustrate it this way—
In Genesis 1 and 2, the creation narrative, Adam and Eve are told not to eat from the tree of the knowledge of good and evil. The question that always comes up is, Why was it bad for Adam and Eve to know the difference between right and wrong? Isn’t that praised everywhere else in Scripture—having conscience and awareness?
If you ask that question, it leads you to different conclusions than just good tree, bad tree. I actually think it’s good tree, good tree—but not yet. This is a minority view, but I believe what’s happening in the text is that Adam and Eve were spiritual, emotional, and mental infants.
Even if God created them with fully grown bodies, they were infants intellectually, emotionally, and spiritually. So, it wasn’t never—it was not yet.
I also think that even when the Watchers came down, many of the things they taught humanity—like the mixing of herbs, which we’d call pharmaceuticals today—were in the category of not yet. Not necessarily never.
Chuck, Fire Theft Radio: I recently saw a Vice documentary that explored people’s beliefs, and one argument that kept coming up was that people didn’t understand why God would prevent Adam and Eve from knowing more things.
Their take was that God is restrictive—that he wants to imprison people, keep them from knowledge. But as a parent, you start to understand the spiritual dimension of parenting. You give your child what they’re ready for.
At least you try to. If they’re not ready, you don’t talk about it yet. Now, as a human parent, we might coddle them too much, but God doesn’t make that mistake—He knows exactly what we’re ready for.
Anthony Delgado: Exactly.
Chuck, Fire Theft Radio: That’s how I perceive the story of Adam and Eve—God was saying, I’m going to give you this knowledge—just not yet.
I’ve always felt that way but haven’t gone back to research it deeply. It just never made sense to me that God wouldn’t want us to know the difference between good and evil. But you kind of see that in the narrative—when they realize they’re naked and feel shame, it’s like they lost their innocence.
Anthony Delgado: You’re totally right. That’s exactly the illustration I use, although I’m usually a bit more direct. I’ll say, Look, you wouldn’t show your three-year-old pornography. That’s the kind of thing we’re talking about here—Adam and Eve weren’t ready.
I’m a big proponent of letting Scripture be Scripture. Regardless of what you believe scientifically, don’t force your views onto the text. Let the narrative be the narrative.
If you need to read Genesis 1 and 2—or all of Genesis, or even Genesis 1-11—allegorically, then read it allegorically. But don’t lose the narrative.
The problem today is that many people have evolutionary ideas about how the first humans came about, and they try to impose those ideas on the biblical text. But we shouldn’t do that.
Let the story speak for itself. If you need to see it as a parable or an allegory to grasp its deeper truths, that’s fine. Just don’t strip it of its power by forcing modern interpretations onto it.
And so they aren’t really reading Genesis 1 as actual science and history—which, in some ways, is the right approach—but then they compromise the narrative to fit their materialistic worldview.
That’s the mistake. You can’t have it both ways. You always have to let the story be the story. You can debate how scientifically or historically accurate it is on the side—that’s esoteric knowledge. But the story is why Moses wrote it down.
So don’t mess with the story.
You can’t ignore the fact that it looks like Adam and Eve were in the garden for just a few days before eating from the tree. That’s what the text suggests, so let it be what it is—they weren’t ready for that knowledge yet.
Chuck, Fire Theft Radio: Did I derail you? Sorry—you mentioned you use this in counseling.
Anthony Delgado: Yeah, I use it in counseling a lot because I want people to understand that everything—whether it’s a relational issue, a psychological issue, or something that actually requires a psychotherapist—is spiritual.
Understanding the Watchers helps lead people down that path. It also allows me to say, Look, you always hold your faith and the truth of Scripture higher than what any therapist tells you. But at the same time, it allows me to tell someone, I think you need professional help beyond pastoral care. You should see a psychologist for this.
Because I do believe in a both-and approach.
Just because the knowledge psychotherapists use might have originally come from the Watchers doesn’t mean it’s entirely bad. The same swords the Watchers taught humanity to forge? God later used those swords to carry out judgment in Canaan.
So just because something exists doesn’t mean God won’t use it. From a counseling perspective, this helps connect the dots.
There are some fundamentalist perspectives that say, Never go to a doctor for anything, especially not mental health. If you’re struggling, it’s because you don’t have enough faith. That turns mental health into a faith-healing issue—like, Oh, you’re depressed because you don’t believe in Jesus hard enough.
That’s just not biblical. This approach allows for a middle ground.
Chuck, Fire Theft Radio: Yeah, absolutely. We need discernment in knowing what steps to take.
When I read some of these Old Testament stories, I think, Man, some of these prophets and leaders definitely had mental health struggles. They went through intense trauma—they were human beings.
Oops—did you hear that?
Anthony Delgado: I did.
Chuck, Fire Theft Radio: Yeah, that was a phone call coming in—sorry about that.
Anthony Delgado: I thought you were cutting me off!
Chuck, Fire Theft Radio: (Laughs) No, no! Let me disconnect my Bluetooth real quick. I always forget my phone is connected to this thing.
Okay, we’re back. But yeah, another thing I wanted to bring up is how much we naturalize human experience. Even as Christians, we often separate things into natural life and spiritual life—like, This is my everyday life, and that’s my faith life.
I highly disagree with that. It is impossible to disconnect from the spiritual world. You were designed by God as a spiritual being.
Even when you go to the doctor, see a psychologist, or just go to school, you’re engaging both the physical and spiritual aspects of yourself. You cannot separate them.
Anthony Delgado: Yeah.
Chuck, Fire Theft Radio: Some of the knowledge that doctors use today was probably handed down through either a Watcher or God.
Same thing with technology—we have people in Silicon Valley micro-dosing psychedelics, having visions, and then developing technology we use today.
It is impossible to live in the physical world without touching some aspect of the spiritual—whether you realize it or not.
And ultimately, everything either comes from God or from the Watchers. It really is that simple.
We’ve de-spiritualized our existence so much that we don’t recognize that everything we do is, in some way, spiritual. Even something as fundamental as learning—where is your knowledge stored? In your brain?
Learning itself is a spiritual thing. God wants you to learn—you were designed that way. That’s the biggest thing people miss.
I mean, we’re called Fire Theft Radio for a reason—it’s a Prometheus reference. If you know the story of Prometheus, the problem wasn’t just that he gave humanity fire, but that he gave them knowledge. That was the real issue.
And I think that’s the story of humanity—too much knowledge can destroy. Even Solomon was a biblical embodiment of that. He couldn’t handle all the wisdom he gained.
Anthony Delgado: At the very least, too much knowledge too quickly, right? Because I do believe there is an eternal learning, an eternal knowing, that happens over time.
But I wanted to show you something—what you’re saying is purely biblical. Jesus literally taught this in John 8:
“Jesus said to them, ‘If God were your Father, you would love me, because I came from God and I am here. For I didn’t come on my own, but he sent me. Why don’t you understand what I say? Because you cannot listen to my word. You are of your father the devil, and you want to carry out your father’s desires. He was a murderer from the beginning and does not stand in the truth because there is no truth in him. When he tells a lie, he speaks from his own nature, because he is a liar and the father of lies.’”
Jesus’ point is that everyone has a spiritual connection to their father—either to God or to the devil.
If we are spiritually connected to God as Father, that influences everything in the material world. And if someone is spiritually connected to the devil, then that influences everything they do as well.
Chuck, Fire Theft Radio: Good, because I don’t want to be a heretic over here! (Laughs)
You mentioned you use this in counseling—what was the other area?
Anthony Delgado: Counseling and evangelism.
On a superficial level, it applies in evangelism because people are actually looking for spiritual things now.
During the period of modernity, people weren’t really interested in spirituality. It was all about philosophical materialism—figuring out how to live a good life and be moral apart from spiritual concerns.
That’s ironic because you can’t have morality without spirituality.
Then postmodernity came along and brought back experimentation. People started saying, Let’s assume everything is meaningless and then figure out what actually matters. That’s when we started hearing, Well, that’s your truth, and this is my truth.
But postmodernity was too loose—it was too relativistic. And now? People are searching for actual truth.
The problem is that the church often doesn’t have the answers—or at least, doesn’t present them in a way that engages this search.
The book I’m working on right now is based on a sermon series I did earlier this year. It’s called The Gospel is Bigger Than You Think.
At an academic level, it’s an exploration of the major atonement theories, but it’s not presented as a scholarly work. The core thesis is that the gospel is not merely that Jesus forgives your sins.
That’s an effect of the gospel, but it’s not the whole gospel.
One of the chapters deals specifically with spiritual warfare—though, really, the theme runs throughout the entire book.
That’s where I unpack the idea of the rulers of the nations. Daniel calls them princes, but they’re the same figures—the Watchers, the sons of God who rule over the nations.
You have these spiritual rulers over the physical rulers—the kings of the nations. And then Jesus shows up in the Great Commission and declares:
“All authority in heaven and on earth has been given to me.”
What does authority in heaven and on earth mean? It means he has dethroned the spiritual rulers.
That’s why Paul, in Romans 13, can say that Christ has appointed the rulers of the nations.
We’re living in a different world now than the Second Temple Jews lived in.
Back then, every nation was ruled by a fallen angel, with a human king acting as his puppet. These human rulers were just as corrupt as the spiritual forces behind them. That was the normal reality for people in the ancient world.
But today, Christ is the assumed King of all nations. The question is whether human rulers recognize his authority or not.
That changes the political and spiritual landscape entirely.
Chuck, Fire Theft Radio: So how does this become evangelistic?
Anthony Delgado: People today are trying to figure out which king they should follow.
I believe the answer is simple: We should follow the King who has dethroned all other kings—in both the spiritual and physical realms.
That’s why, in the end, we see Revelation 21 and 22—the holy city of God descending to earth. That’s the ultimate fulfillment of Christ’s victory.
Chuck, Fire Theft Radio: Right, because so much is being re-instituted, re-consecrated, re-engineered—however you want to phrase it—through the death and resurrection of Jesus Christ.
It makes sense that everything within creation would also be renewed.
I mean, take creation itself—we know the world is in a state of entropy. I don’t think it was meant to be that way.
Maybe I’m reaching here, but it seems like all of creation is waiting for renewal.
That reminds me—doesn’t Romans say that creation is groaning, waiting for something?
Anthony Delgado: Waiting for the revelation of the sons of God.
Chuck, Fire Theft Radio: Absolutely. That’s why there’s going to be a literal new earth—a new world in the future. Because everything in creation has been redeemed. The Creator died so that creation itself could be completely renewed.
Anthony Delgado: Right, absolutely. And that’s the bigger picture.
But so many churches reduce the gospel to, Jesus forgives your sins so that… I don’t know… now when you pray, He hears you.
Let’s be honest—that’s the version of the gospel being preached in a lot of places. Jesus forgives your sins, so now He loves you, and you can pray, and He’ll listen to you.
But think about how materialistic that actually is. If the only reason to believe in Jesus is so you can ask for things, then you’re still operating from a self-centered, transactional mindset.
The bigger narrative says everything is intrinsically spiritual.
For example, we have a member in our church who was formerly Buddhist. That was the spiritual system she followed.
Now, going back to what we said earlier—about how the Watchers take on new names—Buddhism was essentially a Watcher operating under a new name.
She pursued Buddhism for years, but at some point, she realized it wasn’t doing anything. It wasn’t leading anywhere good. It wasn’t transforming her.
And then, one day, a Baptist doing door-to-door evangelism knocked on her door and started telling her about Jesus.
Now, I’m not a big door-knocking Baptist, but in this case, it worked.
Because she had spent years exploring Buddhism, she already understood things on a spiritual level. She already wanted something eternal. She had a longing for spiritual truth.
So when she heard the gospel, it actually made sense to her. And she came to faith.
More and more, I’m seeing people like that. It’s not about convincing people whether there’s a spiritual reality—it’s about helping them figure out which God they are following.
Because here’s the thing—I don’t know about you, but I never meet atheists. I don’t know where this idea came from that evangelism is primarily about debating atheists.
Chuck, Fire Theft Radio: I think they all live where I live, then! I’ve met a few. (Laughs)
Anthony Delgado: (Laughs) Okay, I shouldn’t say I never meet atheists. I do have one friend who’s an atheist, so obviously, they exist.
Chuck, Fire Theft Radio: No, I get what you’re saying. But I do have quite a bit of interaction with atheists, and I think that’s just by design. God puts certain people in our paths.
Because of the kind of work I do, I’m constantly interacting with people in public spaces—places like Stater Bros., Walmart, Target. I meet a lot of different people.
And in the midst of those conversations, I do run into atheists. Some of them have the same old complaints about God, but others actually ask really good questions—questions that force me to dig deeper into Scripture.
But I do get what you’re saying. That whole New Atheism movement from the ‘90s and early 2000s? The Richard Dawkins era? That’s old hat now.
Anthony Delgado: Right. It was trendy for a while, but it didn’t actually answer people’s spiritual questions.
And that’s the same reason religions die—because they stop answering people’s questions.
A practical example of how this applies? Look at that woman from our church who left Buddhism.
Or let’s take another example—let’s say you’re talking to a teenage boy who’s addicted to pornography.
Now, you already know who his god is. You already know what Watcher is influencing him.
So how do you deal with that? You start asking why.
Why do you even want that?
What are you feeling in that moment when you choose to do that?
Because everyone who struggles with it feels ashamed afterward. They don’t want to do it, but they do it anyway.
So you start peeling back the layers.
And eventually, they say something like, I don’t know, I just feel like my life is meaningless.
So you ask, Is your life actually meaningless?
They’ll probably say, No, because of this, that, and the other thing.
Then you ask, Where do you think those good things come from?
Through that process, you help them see that without Christ, their life actually is meaningless. Because without Him, they can’t produce anything lasting, eternal, or truly good.
But through Christ—who has already produced everything lasting and good—they can experience that.
And if they’re open to learning more, you can take it a step further and say, Look, this isn’t a new problem. There’s even an answer for this in ancient literature.
In 1 Enoch, one of the Watchers introduced humanity to the arts of seduction.
It’s right there in the text—lust as a weapon against humanity.
So when people struggle with this today, they’re not just dealing with a habit—they’re caught in a much bigger spiritual battle.
And when they see that? It starts to change their perspective entirely.
Chuck, Fire Theft Radio: I like to joke around and say, Dude, even these Instagram baddies are doing Watcher work. It’s nothing new under the sun.
Because if you read 1 Enoch—and this is something I always wondered about—you read Genesis, and it’s like, Okay, there was sin, God destroyed everything, and that was that. Done deal.
But 1 Enoch actually explains what those sins were.
We’re talking about magic. Experimentation with humans, animals, and women. Abortions—by the way, abortion is explicitly mentioned in 1 Enoch. You read it, and you start thinking, Wait a minute, this sounds a lot like the world I live in today.
That’s what fascinates me.
I watch a lot of things for research purposes—sometimes they’re actually good, but sometimes they go south real fast. Like, I was watching The Witcher, and at first, I thought, Okay, this is kind of interesting. Then it just turned to garbage.
But here’s the thing—there are so many references to the Watchers in media like that.
You see cosmic geography all over it—the idea that there are supernatural beings in charge of different regions of the world, bringing judgment to those areas, and that some of them rebelled. That’s straight out of the Old Testament.
You see this everywhere in our media—movies, TV shows, video games. And these are some of the most popular franchises.
Take The Witcher, Skyrim, or similar games—these are literally just digital versions of Old Testament narratives.
And I feel like it’s intentional.
Because what it does is give people this fake sense of accomplishment—like they’re battling evil, but only in a virtual world.
It’s like, Hey, why fight spiritual battles in real life when you can just do it digitally?
It almost feels like a distraction.
Especially for men—video games provide a simulated sense of journey, accomplishment, and ascension to higher levels. All of that can be found in real spiritual life, but instead, it’s being satiated in a digital world.
Meanwhile, the real spiritual forces are still at work, taking over the world while people are distracted by pretend victories.
I don’t know—I just think it’s dangerous to get caught up in that.
Sorry, I kind of derailed there. Just babbling.
Anthony Delgado: No, I don’t think you’re wrong about that. It’s something to watch closely because, again, the Watchers—the Aggregor—are constantly taking on new names.
If that new name is something like Call of Duty—and I’m not a gamer, so I don’t know what’s out there—but whatever that name is, you have to ask, Are you getting absorbed into that god’s world?
The Witcher is interesting because there are good themes—he really is battling monsters. You almost want to say he’s a Christ figure. But the problem is, he’s not the Christ figure—he’s just as broken as the monsters he’s killing.
I’ve seen a little of it too, and I think it’s interesting. But if anything, I’d say he’s not Christ—he’s Hercules.
Because if you read the story of Hercules against the backdrop of the Bible, he’s a Nephilim.
Look at Goliath—he was the hero of the Philistines. Their champion.
Goliath is Hercules.
Not literally, but in terms of the character type—he’s the hero of his people, he defeats their monsters. But he himself is just as much a monster in the eyes of God.
So when we see these kinds of characters in media, they often look like heroes, but in a biblical framework, they’re not the real heroes.
Actually, there’s something I wanted to bring up that ties into this—
If you look at the giants in Scripture and 1 Enoch, there’s something theological and evangelistic about them.
As a kid, I was taught that demons were fallen angels. But then I got into this research, and I was told demons are actually the disembodied spirits of the Nephilim.
When I started studying 1 Enoch, I realized there’s actually a more comprehensive answer.
The term demon is used in two different ways in the New Testament.
For example, in 1 Corinthians, Paul quotes Deuteronomy 32 and says that the gods of the nations are demons.
Moses uses the Hebrew word shedim, while Paul, writing in Greek, uses daimonia—which, in Greek, refers to a lesser god.
So Paul and Moses are talking about something a little different than what Jesus means when he talks about demons.
When we talk about the Watchers, the Aggregor, we’re talking about highly intelligent spiritual beings—fallen sons of God who don’t normally manifest in a material way.
I won’t say never, because we know angels can appear in human form. If angels can do that, then sure, the Watchers could too.
But in normal cases, we’re dealing with spiritual rulers.
What is the divine ruler of a nation, if not a spiritual being operating in the world?
That’s how you connect this to things like artificial intelligence or video games. The Watchers don’t need to keep the same names or manifest in the same ways—they’ll adapt to whatever suits the current era.
But that doesn’t make them any less of a Watcher or a fallen son of God.
On the other hand, the chaotic demons we see in the Gospels and Acts—the ones possessing people—are something different.
1 Enoch tells us those demons are the spirits of the Nephilim.
For anyone reading the book, this is covered in Chapter 3 under The Origin of the Demons.
This distinction actually gets hidden in English translations.
For example, Job 26:5-6 says:
"The departed spirits tremble beneath the waters."
But the Hebrew word translated as departed spirits is Rephaim—which literally means giants.
In Greek translations, that word is gigantes, which also means giants.
So everything points to the fact that Job is actually talking about the departed spirits of the giants.
Now, what were the giants like when they were alive?
They were aggressive, chaotic, violent warriors.
I don’t care how big or small you think they were—their nature was chaotic violence.
So what happens when they die? Their spirits remain chaotic and violent.
That’s why the demons in the Gospels act the way they do.
Think about it—what does a Watcher have to gain by possessing a child and throwing him into the fire?
From a strategic standpoint, nothing. It doesn’t advance their agenda.
But a chaotic spirit? A violent, tormented entity? That’s exactly what they would do.
So the demons that Jesus casts out are something different than the fallen sons of God in Genesis 6.
Understanding this clears up a lot—theologically, pastorally, and evangelistically.
And it actually answers a huge question people ask:
Why are there good people in the world?
Most people want to believe in spiritual things—but they also want to be universalists.
They want to believe that any path toward goodness leads to salvation.
And I’ll tell you right now—there is nothing more demonic in our culture than universalism.
It is the single most dangerous teaching today because it keeps people right outside the Kingdom of God.
It doesn’t try to deny the existence of Jesus—it just says, You don’t need Him to be saved.
And that’s exactly what the devil and his angels want.
They are strategically positioning people right outside of the Kingdom, making them believe they don’t need Christ as the way, the truth, and the life.
So we end up with very moral people in our society—good people—who are standing right outside the gates of the Kingdom, thinking they’re fine.
But when judgment comes, they’ll be eternally condemned because they never entered.
This is why understanding the difference between Watchers and demons is so important.
They’re not the same in the Scriptures.
They’re not the same in 1 Enoch.
And they’re not the same in the world today.
Chuck, Fire Theft Radio: Yeah. I’m really glad you made that distinction—I was going to ask you about it, but you answered it before I could.
Anthony Delgado: I think it might be the most interesting thing in the book.
Chuck, Fire Theft Radio: Well, this isn’t in the book—at least, I don’t think so; I have a few pages left—but I’m wondering, has your congregation ever brought up extraterrestrials?
That’s huge right now. It’s so public. It’s on big podcasts, and people just casually say, Oh yeah, aliens are real—like it’s no big deal.
The conversation can go in so many directions. And since you sometimes dabble in these kinds of weird topics, has this ever come up for you?
Have you ever made any connections between what you’ve written in the book and the alien phenomenon?
Anthony Delgado: I joke about it from time to time because it’s not something I can be dogmatic about—but I do want people to think about it.
And actually, transitioning from our conversation about the difference between Watchers and demons, I think the alien conversation patterns right on top of that.
I’m a big fan of a newer podcast called The Haunted Cosmos. I’ve listened to a handful of their episodes, and one of the things I immediately noticed is how they compile and document all these spiritual encounters from history.
One of the key takeaways is that some spiritual entities are just chaotic—completely unpredictable and violent—like the demons we see in Scripture.
And aliens? They often fit that same pattern.
Aliens come up in so many abduction stories throughout history. They weren’t always called “extraterrestrials,” but when you read these accounts, it’s pretty obvious that they line up with modern alien reports.
Sometimes these beings are chaotic and terrifying. Other times, they appear benevolent.
Take Bigfoot, for example. I used to think Bigfoot was ridiculous—just some urban legend.
But then I started looking into the stories, and you see patterns. Sometimes Bigfoot is described as demonic—hunting and attacking people. Other times, he’s just hiding, avoiding human interaction. And in some cases, he seems almost benevolent—but still deceptive.
That exact pattern exists when you study the spirit world.
Sometimes the spirit world is chaotic and violent.
Sometimes it’s hidden—it’s there, but we can’t quite see it.
And sometimes, it seems benevolent—but, like we discussed with the Watchers, it’s actually leading people just slightly away from Christ, keeping them just outside the Kingdom of God.
That’s why I think—this is probably a gross oversimplification—but I think all of these things are telling the same story.
It doesn’t matter whether we’re talking about aliens, demons, Watchers, Bigfoot, Skinwalkers, or other folklore beings.
In a narrative sense, they’re all pointing to the same spiritual reality.
Chuck, Fire Theft Radio: Yeah, you definitely can’t just dismiss it.
We’ve talked about this on the show before—so many people who’ve had abduction experiences say that the abduction stops when they pray to Jesus.
Specifically Jesus.
People have tried praying other prayers, invoking different names—but it doesn’t work.
But for some reason, these beings hate the name of Jesus. The moment someone calls on Him, the experience stops.
We did an episode on this with Jim Wilhelmson—he’s a pastor whose entire ministry is dedicated to helping people who have gone through the abduction phenomenon.
He himself was an abductee.
He also worked with Heiser, and he came to the conclusion that there’s absolutely a spiritual connection here.
Of course, when you follow the trail, it all leads back to the same place:
Demons → Daimonia → Shedim → Giants → Watchers → The Rebellion.
It’s not a far stretch.
I’m not some crazy guy with red string connecting conspiracy theories in my basement—it’s all right there.
If you just look a little deeper, the connections are undeniable.
Anthony Delgado: You know, I think everybody knows this is true anyway. Maybe people don’t want to admit it out loud, but deep down, I think they know.
Think about it—you and I are about the same age. I think I’m a couple of years older than you. But remember the alien movies from when we were kids?
I’m thinking of E.T., Mac and Me, Close Encounters of the Third Kind—movies where aliens are portrayed as weird, but ultimately benevolent.
Then you have Alien and Predator, where the aliens are just chaotic monsters.
Why the contrast?
And here’s my point—we never questioned it.
No one ever said, Wait, this alien movie doesn’t make sense because E.T. was nice, and we all know aliens are nice!
We instinctively understood that otherworldly beings manifest in different ways because human history has always experienced them that way.
Chuck, Fire Theft Radio: Exactly. And when we look at the holy ones—the ones that aren’t fallen, the faithful angels and different classes of divine beings—they, too, are technically extraterrestrial.
They’re not from here.
So our experiences with them could be good as well.
Now, I’m skeptical about people’s spiritual experiences, but I don’t disregard them outright. I wouldn’t say, Oh, people can’t see angels.
I mean, before I became a Christian, we practiced witchcraft, and the paranormal activity in our house was insane.
It was like something straight out of Paranormal Activity.
So I know these kinds of experiences are real. And I also believe people can have positive, God-given spiritual encounters.
But the problem today is that we’ve lost that sense of enchantment.
We’ve lost the ability to believe that we can interact with the spiritual world.
And I think that’s what people are thirsty for.
That’s why I appreciate your book—it brings people back to understanding that the physical world is much more spiritual than we realize. We need to interact with that reality more.
Now, is there any aspect of your book that I didn’t bring up—something you wish I had asked you about?
Anthony Delgado: Yeah, I’d say the demons and giants connection.
I was on another podcast a couple of months ago, and I remember thinking afterward, Dang, that was the one thing I wanted to talk about, but it never came up.
So this time, I was determined to work it in.
The other big thing is how to use Heiser’s work and 1 Enoch in an evangelical church.
Because let’s be real—most people see 1 Enoch isn’t in the Bible, so they assume, We should stay away from that.
That’s actually the whole point of my book.
When I first started talking about these ideas in my church, people were rightly skeptical.
They wanted to know, Where are you getting this from?
As much as I could, I showed them these ideas directly from Scripture.
But I also wanted to give them something tangible—specifically, the Book of the Watchers (the first section of 1 Enoch).
That’s why I wrote this book.
It’s not heavy on commentary. It’s mostly just Bible verses alongside my theological paraphrase of the Book of the Watchers.
It’s designed as a safe way for evangelical Christians to read 1 Enoch, see the connections, and draw their own conclusions.
So if any of your listeners are having trouble discussing these topics in their churches—if they’re talking to their pastors and getting resistance—this book might be a good entry point.
It can help them say, Hey, let’s take a look at this. There are more connections here than you might think.
And one last thing—I didn’t write this book to make money.
So if anyone wants to use it in their church, I can set up a bulk order deal at a special discount.
If that’s something people are interested in, they can contact me through my website, and I’d be happy to work something out.
This book was written for the church—use it however you see fit.
Chuck, Fire Theft Radio: That’s awesome. I really appreciate that.
I think resources like this are necessary.
The more information we have that can be practically used in church, the better.
So where can people find your work? Where can they listen to your podcast?
Anthony Delgado: The podcast is everywhere—just search Biblical Re-enchantment, and you’ll find it.
It’ll show up as Anthony Delgado – Biblical Re-enchantment.
I know re-enchantment is a long word, so just make sure to spell it correctly.
You can also find links to everything on my website: anthonydelgado.net.
That’s the hub for all my work—books, contact info, everything.
If you want a single copy of the book, it’s available on Kindle, paperback—everywhere except audio right now. Hopefully, that’ll come soon.
Chuck, Fire Theft Radio: Cool, man. Well, this was a great conversation.
As always, folks, if you have questions, reach out. I’ll put Anthony’s website in the episode bio so you can continue your research.
I highly recommend having these conversations in your Bible study groups.
That was the whole point of this episode.
Because here at Fire Theft Radio, we talk about Watchers and demons like it’s normal business.
But I’ve noticed we’ve got a lot of new listeners lately—people who are just now landing on the show—and they’re saying, You guys are making me ask questions I never thought about before.
So I wanted to go back to our roots—back to the early content we covered in episodes 1-15.
If you haven’t gone back that far, we did a ton of episodes on Nephilim, demons, and cosmic geography.
We even had Dr. Michael Heiser on a couple of times—one episode specifically about demons, which remains one of our most downloaded episodes to this day.
That one was recorded before he passed—of course, now the late Dr. Michael Heiser.
So if you’re wondering where Anthony Delgado is getting his research from—it’s scholarly sources.
This isn’t just a couple of podcasters spitballing ideas.
We’re not doing what some of these guys do—just throwing out random claims about the Bible with no real context.
That’s why I think this episode is so important—it serves two purposes:
It introduces these topics into church spaces, helping people engage with biblical theology from an Ancient Near Eastern perspective.
It provides context for the fringier side of things—because sometimes, people go off the rails and start quoting random sources without grounding it in Scripture.
That’s what we do here at Fire Theft Radio—we bring people back to the Bible, even when discussing the weird stuff.
So that’s all we’ve got for you today, folks.
Links are in the bio.
And as always… don’t forget to spread the fire.
